Today I went to Vintage Fair, I won't say which one. I would now like to have a mini rant.
For those of us that choose to wear vintage everyday, being able to buy cheaper clothes is very important, just as it is to non-vintage wearers. I am prepared to pay more for really special items; floor length gowns, unusual prints, fur, shoes that actually fit well, coats, and older items from the 20s and 30s that you would expect to pay more for. That really special item that you know when you find it is completely unusual, special and a definite one off.
The first item I picked up at said vintage fair was a small square leather 1950s box bag. It was unusual in its shape and colour, being a really nice cream leather, but not so unusual that I've never seen anything like it before. I was slightly disgusted to find that it cost £65! I would have paid £30 tops. There are tonnes of similar bags here for half the price.
So Mr Vintage Seller, who are you trying to sell to? The girl that normally shops in Top Shop and is used to paying too much for something badly made that she will probably deem unfashionable by 'next season' who likes to flirt with a bit of vintage because some Sunday supplement has told her that the Mad Men look is 'in'. Or, me and my friends who are genuinely looking for something special and will appreciate your goods.
Now I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with shopping in TopShop, (I used to shop there) and also being interested in vintage clothing. But, I am slightly annoyed at how vintage slips in and out of fashion causing those who normally shop on the high street to show an interest, causing vintage sellers to take advantage of their lack of vintage price knowledge, inevitably rising the prices for everyone else.
What I am saying I suppose is don't pay through the nose for vintage unless it is really special!! You can find sellers who won't take advantage, in shops, online (ebay and etsy especially) and at fairs if you look hard enough. Comparing prices at different stalls made it obvious to me and my pals who were real vintage lovers and wanted to sell at affordable prices because they want the clothes to sell, and they want them to go to good homes, whether that be to someone that wears vintage everyday, or someone that just wants to wear something a bit special now and then, and stalls run by people just there to make money, but probably will only sell a few things because everything they sell is hideously overpriced.
I bought a dress that cost £55. That is alot of money for me to spend on one item and I hardly ever do that. I rarely shop anywhere other than online actually. I was prepared to pay for it though because the item is so unusual and fits so well. The stall we bought it from was actually the only stall that we found that we believed was priced properly, and similar items on other stalls were priced at least 30% more. The item I bought is a red 1950s dress with cream mohair cuff, collars and lacing detail with pom poms. I have never seen anything quite like it before and absolutely adore it. It is the perfect Christmas frock, and I promise to photograph soon!
The purpose of my rant is basically to warn you not to get ripped off unless you are really sure that it is absolutely worth it and you can't find anything else similar for much cheaper. I just don't like beautiful vintage clothes going to the wrong homes just because they have been made unaffordable. It makes me sad :-( RANT OVER!
Hmm, if that is the Vintage Fair in London I was going to go to, I am glad I didn't make the trek in the pouring rain. I am happy to pay a fair price for something, but sometimes sellers just can't seem to help themselves and try to rip people off. Such a shame.
ReplyDeleteI am just getting into vintage myself, and I am also finding the prices shocking. It makes me feel like I just can't afford to really enjoy vintage myself :(
ReplyDeleteI found a similar thing when I went round a vintage fair that happened to be on when I was in Bath. I was really horrified by some of the prices, especially for things that weren't actually in very good condition. I found a couple of scarves I quite liked but the stall holder wanted stupid money for them because one was apparently 'silk'. Er no it wasn't! It was also filthy dirty. She had no idea of the actual age of most of her stock either, ie; most of it was not from the era's she said it was. As you say just someone jumping on the vintage is in bandwagon to rip people off.
ReplyDeleteLady C: Yes it probably was the same one, if i hadn't bought the dress i would have been happy to stay in bed!
ReplyDeleteSirens: But you can! Just don't go to fairs like that, just spend some time searching online, but make sure you know your measurements well and you can find many bargains!x
Miss Magpie: Yes i resent buying it even more when its from someone who doesn't know anything about it/appreciate it themselves
ReplyDeleteI could go on forever about this subject so I’ll only say that I TOTALLY agree!
ReplyDeleteOh and maybe one more thing.....I hate it when sellers lord it over you, claiming that they know more about vintage and that you know nothing----oooow, it makes me so cross!
xx tups xx
Yes indeed! May i add that NONE of these sellers were actually wearing vintage themselves!!!!
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ReplyDeleteWhen I was in the UK, I noticed everything was exorbitantly expensive. Sellers would tell me that this is because there is a limited supply of everything being an island country, so prices are affected by the fact that things have to be shipped using air or sea, which costs more due to diesel. From the perspective of vintage, I still think there was a bit more supply of great stuff from the 30s, 40s, 50s than I have seen here in Canada, so it seems unfair that vendors are pricing the vintage so high when the supply doesn't seem so short to warrant higher prices (as per the old economic supply-demand principles)?
ReplyDeleteI would imagine vendors in the UK are like the ones here in Canada: they either foolishly cling to the idea that they should have brick and mortar shops that they have to pay ridiculously high rent for (thus necessitating ridiculous prices) or they only sell at vintage fairs and so try to get as much bang for their buck out of customers when they do go to the shows. If some of these sellers would go online, they would have some perspective as to how much lower the overhead is to run a virtual shop, how many more customers they could reach, how much less headache it would be for them (they wouldn't have to cart their tubs of stuff here and there); they would also be able to calibrate their prices against those of the online marketplace more effectively.
Given that the exchange rates work in your favour from UK to US and there is even more supply of 50s items in the US, I would definitely do most of my shopping online from North America if I lived in England. Even with shipping costs, it must be waaaay cheaper to buy online! Here in Canada, supply is so scarce that some vintage shops price like fools. Example: I saw some pretty 50s dresses, in good but not pristine condition selling at a local vintage shop for $400.00 USD. Give me a break! I asked the shop keeper why: she replied, well these are rare antiques! HUH!?
I know, anything over £100 is absolutely laughable to me. It is definitely in our favour to buy online from the US. My vintage pals and I were even discussing saving up and going to the States on a shipping trip and just buying bulk! Its quite sad really that its like this over here :-(
ReplyDeleteI could so easily have a big rant of my own about this! I recently went to a vintage shop that sells mainly 80s stuff - they have a 'special' rack of 40s and 50s stuff - which they charge a huge amount for - no matter what condition it's in - one 40s dress was completely falling apart and pretty much irreparable; it was still so expensive! I also hate how so many ebay/etsy sellers are tagging the word Mad Men into the search terms -no matter what era the dress is from - but that's a different issue. Love your blog by the way.
ReplyDeleteThanks Ray, I think we could all go on about this forever! And you're right, selling something tatty and in bad condition for a high price just because its old is completely wrong! Grrr!!
ReplyDeleteI have to say I agree but I spoke to some vintage dealers I know and interestingly they said that vintage stuff is getting so hard to find now because everyone is buying it that the dealers are struggling to find deals so passing a deal on is getting harder.
ReplyDeleteI'm not a vintage dealer but the ones I spoke to are ones who try to keep their prices fair and really despair that they are having to charge what they do. Although I doubt any of the vintage dealers I know charge the prices that you are talking about.
Just trying to look at it from the other side. I do despair at prices but then those people have gone out to buy the stuff, so I know they have spent time & money doing so. I think the biggest problem is with it being fashionable at the moment, I'm sure as soon as it drops out of fashion the prices will go back to being reasonable again, please let it be soon!
I find that some sellers up the price when they see how I look(no not a ginger thing) They assume you will pay through the nose...
ReplyDeleteI have to agree! I think what's happening is that quality vintage stocks are starting to run low in the UK after all these years. I've been selling bits and pieces for twenty odd years in one way or another. When when I was a teenager, Twenties, Thirties and Forties gear regularly turned up at jumble sales and charity shops, not to mention things that were given away by elderly family members. It was inevitable that prices would go up I think and dealers are not always sympathetic to the buyer. x
ReplyDeleteFiona: I can see the sellers side, but as Jill said above, it would work out cheaper for them, and us if they sold online! Lots of the sellers I spoke to today said they only sell at fairs where they no doubt have to spend extortionate fees on having a stall. But I suppose my main issue is that vintage is 'in fashion' thus causing the prices to soar.As you said I hope it doesn't last long!
ReplyDeleteI think that more and more of us are buying online from the US so over the next few years there will be more and more vintage filtering through into the UK and hopefully that will help a bit.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you I went into a vintage store last week but they mostly had things from the 70s and 80s. So I looked around the only 40s and 50s clothes the had were on one rack I found a dress but saw the price tag $300.00. It had stains at the bottom also and missing three buttons on the back so I put it back.So I'll stick to Ebay.
ReplyDeleteI thought I left a comment earlier but can't see it now. Sorry if it was offensive in some way. :-(
ReplyDeleteWhat I was trying to say is that the prices are indeed shocking but that compared to some of the other fairs and most vintage shops this fair is much more "affordable." Really, try Hammersmith, or my personal bete noir a shop called "My Sugarland" in Islington...GRRRR (£80 *on sale* price for a very dull 60's pillbox hat with a 50p sized stain that appeared to be blood on it!)
I suppose though, that while it does hurt the pocket, there are some mitigating factors: vintage is going to be much nicer and more well made than anything modern so paying a TopShop price for something better than TopShop makes sense and secondly, when buying vintage from a fair you get to try on the garment, check for damage etc thus removing the risk of eBay where things aren't always as described.
I'm rambling and blathering... but what I mean is I don't mind being charged a reasonable price (£30-40 for a day dress, £100 for a suit etc etc)but I do hate places that hike prices up unreasonably.
Your comment never appeared Lisa. I wouldn't dare delete you! I know what you're saying, I can see it from all angles, but overpricing just infuriates me!
ReplyDeleteHERE HERE! I saw an umberella as I left for sixty quid... SIXTY QUID! I'd be afraid to get it wet! x
ReplyDeleteBloody ridiculous!!!!
ReplyDeleteI completely agree with you. I worked in a vintage shop and our average price for a 40s-50s cocktail dress with no flaws was $68 (I think that is about 50 pounds) and a day dress was usually $48. When something really special came in we would price it higher. One day I opened the store to find 5 Emma Domb gowns for me to price. I priced them $130-$180 since they were very special and a sought-after designer.
ReplyDeleteI am getting very frustrated with online sellers who are selling cotton dresses from the 50s and early 60s for over $100 when they don't even have a designer label on them, just because they have a circle skirt. Those dealers who are overpricing their stuff are losing out on regular customers who would buy from them after the trend of vintage is over.
You have summed up EXACTLY how I feel. Bravo! :)
ReplyDeleteI was dashing out before but now I have more time to think about this topic and the other bloggers' fantastic posts. I have to say I'm always lying awake thinking about these sorts of issues and it's so tricky. On the one hand, when vintage wasn't as popular, it was awesome for the buyer. Now that vintage is more popular, I do love that more people are turning away from the poorly made cheap clothes pumped out by multinational corporations (from an environmental standpoint, it's a promising ethos). However, I think you are totally right, Yesterday Girl, that this increased demand is causing higher prices (in part because sellers are sometimes trying to capitalize on this "trend" but also in part because they are realising the reality of vintage business--there is only a limited supply of vintage. When demand increases but supply is limited, it's a buyer's market). In the end, the increased popularity of vintage has allowed me, for example, to run a business I could never have run 10 years ago (if vintage wasn't popular, I couldn't make a living as a seller). HOWEVER, as a collector, I am aware that once the vintage "trend" is over, the already depleting vintage stocks will be less than they were before (esp. when you have the likes of gals like Lily Allen claiming to be a vintage designer, which involves chopping up intact vintage to make a new frock). SO COMPLEX!!
ReplyDeleteIndeed! And I must add Jill, that your shop of exquisitely picked items is the kind of shop that I would expect to see a higher price margin on, especially considering the age of most of the items in your shop. People will go to you because they want a certain quality and are prepared to pay the correct price for it. :-)
ReplyDeleteThis is obviously a hot topic at the mo, for both buyers and sellers, I'm very intrigued to see what is going to happen over the next year or so. Thanks all for this lively discussion! x
Oh, and don't get me started on Lily Allen....
ReplyDeleteWhen it comes to vintage, I prefer clothes from estates, and there are still plenty of 40s and 50s available at estates. One of the consignors at the shop I worked at works for most of the estate sale companies in our area and gets first dibs on most of the clothes, so I have been fortunate the last few years to obtain estate clothing that has not been damaged. In the US you can still find reasonably priced vintage and vintage sellers who really know their stuff, don't gauge you.
ReplyDeleteThis is a good topic to remind all of us who have good collections to take care of it all, so our supply won't be too depleted in the future.
Oh I'm glad I didn't go. One bad thing about vintage becoming popular is that you get a lot of people selling who don't really know their stuff, and are in it just to make a bit of cash. I do also have to say that it can be hugely expensive to rent spaces at fairs, which is why I don't do it any more (in fact I only did it twice before giving up). The space rental is so high that you have to push your prices up just to cover the cost, I felt horrible doing it and was just stressed all day about how I was going to make any money back at all. It is so much better doing things online, both as a buyer and seller, I'm much happier now selling on etsy. It is a shame, but with vintage it really is a case of buyer beware - you have to know what you are looking for and what it is worth so you don't get ripped off. The one that annoys me most is people selling 80s dresses with horrid elastic waists on ebay as 50s frocks!
ReplyDeleteI have to say, recently I paid an awful lot of money for a dress on Etsy from the states, which was my choice. I have to work 2 nights a total of 24 hours to pay for it. My choice! I get a vile annoymous email from someone on etsy for actually daring to purchase this dress. Sadly it is a sellers market.
ReplyDeleteI have been wearing vintage since I was 13, That's 32 years, yes, buying and wearing for 32 years.
There is a lack of quality vintage now in the UK, I do remember going to Oxfam in Harrogate and coming out with huge amounts of 30's 40's & 50's booty for a SONG.
Sadly, those times are long gone, I believe there is less around and the prices have gone up in the UK.
I do agree there is a lack of UK based quality stuff.
When the dealers used to buy from the States the exchange rate say in 2006-7 was $2 to the GBP, they got more, much more for their money.
I am stuck in the Channel Islands, there is certainly
no 30's & 40's stuff here, due to the occupation people wore their clothes to death, literally.
Correct me if I am wrong, but Vintage fairs to me are much akin to Antique fairs, I always find them overpriced too.
I guess I am agreeing with you, but I'd say, take a leaf out of my book, build up a nice relationship with your online sellers and enjoy buying from them and giving them the business. I get more pleasure
dealing with the small core of vintage selling friends online than I ever would feeling annoyed at seeing some nitwit taking my hard earned cash!
hahaha xx lots of love xx
Very interesting point! I find it quite cynical to see how the same sellers add another £30, £40 to their prices when they go to popular fairs in up-market areas like Chelsea (Frcok Me) cause they know the crowd there can afford to spend £100 on a 'Biba-look-a-like' dress.
ReplyDeleteIt's one thing to know what clothing is worth if you are into vintage but some of my friends who just buy a few pieces once in a while, have been horribly ripped off paying through the roof for tat. Case in point: most of the shops on Brick Lane, all the celeb owned vintage shops and those who market themselves as 'hand-selected' or 'high-quality'so they can put their prices at £80 plus....
I went to an out of the way fair in North Norfolk this weekend and there was a seller there with racks of dresses dating from the 30s to the 80s and not a single one was under £100. There were a few special pieces but mostly it was basic day dresses.
ReplyDeleteIt made me quite sad really as I actually had money to spend and if some of them had been at a more realistic £40 mark I might have been able to buy one. To be fair most of the other sellers were very reasonable, but sadly I didn't find anything that day.
I do appreciate that sellers need to make money where they can, but it's such a shame that some push the prices to the limits (I went to a blogger event at My Sugarland and have to confess that my little provincial heart skipped several beats at those massively inflated London prices!)
I also mostly buy online, but I get almost as infuriated trawling through pages of "mislabelled" vintage items. It's not mislabelling to list primark in the vintage section, it's LYING, as is putting 40s dress all over the title and item specifics when it's actually an 80s dress. I have lots of 70s and 80s 40s style dresses that I like and are great for everyday, but putting them in the wrong category makes refining a search on eBay impossible.
What a great point you've brought up Jeni. Back in Leicester there's a stall that sells 'vintage' (ie. mainly from the 70s onwards) clothes but sometimes they have the odd item from the 40s/50s. They used to be reasonably priced but lately have shot their prices up by ridiculous amounts for a load of old tat. I certainly don't mind paying a bit more if the item is something different and good quality, like from fabgabs or Jill but I certainly won't pay £60 for an 80s dress when I can get a nice 40s one for £40 on etsy. I think it is to do with vintage being in fashion, all the sellers are hiking their prices up to gain a few extra bucks. And normally they're the ones who don't have any interest in vintage. I understand that sellers need to make money, but not by selling crap with the word vintage attached.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that as soon as you add the word vintage prices go up double.
Another person just getting into vintage here, and finding the prices are often... not a barrier to entry, but sufficient to make the growing of my vintage collection a rather slower process than I'd like. I'm not the world's most patient person and would obviously like All Of Etsy Now Please, but I have neither the budget nor the inclination to stump up £150 for a pretty-but-standard cotton dress!
ReplyDeleteThat said, taking a slow and sustainable approach to the acquisition of quality pieces is a good thing in the long run, I think. I very much appreciate the few items I have and those sellers that have a pricing policy which seems to value their time and the garments without just sticking an extra 0 on the end and the word 'Joan' in the title seemingly at random.
I had to say: when you walk into the high street and see a repro that is cheaper than the real thing, it really beggars belief. Vintage items probably had higher production values in another sense though, perhaps the new stuff in a vintage 'style' is reflecting its low quality : ) I keep away from Primark etc. for the main, as the stuff just falls apart. I'd be surprised if you see any of it in thirty or forty years time. Can you imagine!
ReplyDeleteI agree, don't go to a vintage fair if you want a bargain. To hire a stall there can cost upto £300 per day!
ReplyDeleteI think the horendeous amount of VAT the seller has to pay is what is making the price of vintage go up, this is going to increase next year too. This is a recent government idea. Plus, its not cheap to run a business these days...there are SO many expences that most traders are just about braking even if they are lucky.
I think a lot of Ebay sellers are not paying the vat to be honest...and maybe they have another full time job or are retired.
Anyway, there's only one way to find a bargain...dig!
Good post lady... I have nothing to add except that I agree with you!
ReplyDeleteI agress totally with very thing you said, those of us who wear vintage as a life style are being out priced by those who are following a here today gone tomorrow trend it is so annoying
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